the warfare is mental: Photography

About TWIM

The Warfare Is Mental (TWIM) reflects the mental warfare of an author, screenwriter, publisher and member of the Writer's Guild of America. Family, friends, health, humor, art, music, science, faith, fun and knowledge are some of the things that are important to me.

TWIM is the first and only theist blog listed on the Atheist Blogroll, which currently contains over 1,000 blogs. It goes without saying that I don't endorse hardly any of the views of any of them. Contact Mojoey for more information.

Ironically, TWIM won an award for "Best Atheist / Skeptic Site" from this site. Much obliged.

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Thank you for your wonderful response - so reasoned in the race of [Waldvogel's] blustering.

-Annie Laurie Gaylor
FFRF
Thanks for a great Op-Ed. Let me know if there was anything inaccurate in it.

-Marianne Ratcliff
Ventura County Star
...as atheists we need to make sure that someone like cl and any Christian readers of [An Apostate's Chapel] don’t come away with the perception that the atheists caved in or were incapable of responding. I’m sure that a lot of Christians who find cl incomprehensible at times and don’t even bother reading him themselves will come away with an assumption that cl is that sort of rare intellectual theist who can prove that gods exist. And that’s how those inane rumors about the feared xian intellectuals start…

-bbk
An Apostate's Chapel
You are in so over your head here, you are embarrassing yourself...
I am well versed in many aspects of evolution biology, through my academic background, and my professional life. Unless your academic degrees and background match mine, cease and desist. Return to philosophy and rhetoric, or whatever it is you perceive your strengths to be. They are definitely not science, even at the high school level.

-R.C. Moore
Evangelical Realism
You're doing a fine job.

-Prof. Larry Moran
Dept. of Biochemistry
University of Toronto
re: R.C. Moore & others
Phyletic change and vicariance (or, drift and selection versus population isolation), as cl points out, are much better ways of describing what are unfortunately more commonly known as micro- and macro- evolution, respectively.

-Dan
Biology postdoc
Univ. of Cyprus
re: R.C. Moore & others
cl says, “The minute you call yourself a Christian or an Atheist or whatever the heck else, you automatically get painted by other people’s interpretations of those words, which are almost always different and almost always distorted.” cl’s point couldn’t be more on. As cl points out there is an important reason for not claiming any real religious (or lack thereof) belief. It puts logical constraints on one's arguments due directly to the bias of the individual that is translating the English to mind ideas of what it means to be religious.

-Bobaloo
cl, I have to say, while I fundamentally disagree with you, you are an individual which I highly respect. I think your responses are always well thought out and your insights always well thought out and pertinently derived.
[Y]ou have made me a stronger atheist in my regards to critical thinking and debating. I really can’t wait to hear more from you. Hell, I’d even buy you a drink, good sir. Cheers!

-Parker
Evangelical Realism
Bottom line? Sometimes I think he's right about certain arguments, and I don't have a problem admitting that. Other times, however, I think he's wrong, and I've called him on that. But I have found he can be pretty reasonable if you (1) don't overstate your case, (2) make concessions when you have, and (3) insist he do the same.

-Lifeguard
I like it when [cl] makes me stop, think and question if I am making unfounded assertions or if I am being sloppy. What has been annoying me about cl of late is that he is being excruciatingly anal...

-seantheblogonaut
I really can't thank you enough for catching me on my error in rhetoric.
I always love a good debate! And I always enjoy your posts, as well! Keep up the great writing and the excellent eye
for detail!

-Briana Zimmerman
GLST 15
City College
of San Francisco
You make me smarter...

-Mike G.
..thank you, cl. I discovered your blog on a random web search and saw it as an oasis amidst a vast desert of seemingly intractable theist-atheist debate.

-Sung Jun
It's good to be able to discuss with people who are open and respectful, and know that disagreement does not mean disrespect... You are to be congratulated, not only for your patience, but also your ability to hold an ever-growing debate together with an impressive degree of structure.

-Ritchie
My tone is derogatory... [cl is] ignorant and credulous and deserves to be mocked... In the time he's been here, he's shown a consistent pattern of antagonizing everyone he comes in contact with, monopolizing threads, derailing discussions with perpetual complaints, quibbles and demands for attention, and generally making arguments that display a lack of good faith and responsiveness... it's become intolerable. I'm not banning him, but I'm putting in place some restrictions on how often he can comment.

-Ebonmuse
Daylight Atheism
This is no defense of the annoying cl, but what a self-righteous, prissy atheist you turned out to be, Ebonmuse. I'm disappointed in you, stealing a strategem from the theists.

-The Exterminator
to Ebonmuse
I certainly didn't get any bad impression about cl, and I can't relate his comments with any of the things (Ebonmuse) said above. I actually thought it was quite interesting to have him around.

-Juan Felipe
Daylight Atheism
Please continue to allow
cl to post his views and make it clear that he is still welcome. And let me be clear, cl is not a lunatic.

-Curtis
Daylight Atheism
With one exception, you are the most coherent and intelligent theist I've seen on this site...

-Steve Bowen
Daylight Atheism
I'm rooting for cl. I hope he perpetually manages to skirt the rules enough to do his damage, forcing rule revision after rule revision, ad nauseum. Awesome! Let's watch as Ebon, ever more frustrated, continues to struggle to figure out how to keep his precious private blog neat and tidy as cl keeps messing up his papers while one by one, readers leave due to an every increasing administrative presence. Outstanding! Well I won't go. The thought of this sounds like the most entertaining thing that probably would have ever happened on Daylight Atheism. Hot damn!

-PhillyChief
Your visit has been something of a reality check to me. It seems that when you present rational arguments and criticisms, many commenters feel territory slipping and then work up vaporous or leaky responses. I also want to remark that your presence here has considerably moved me to try being a more careful and understanding debater...

-Brad
Daylight Atheism
I am not going to waste any more time parsing your comments to decide if they've crossed the line or not... So I banned you.

-Greta Christina
Be rude... cl invites rudeness. Would you want an incontinent little puppy coming into your house?

-(((Billy))) the Atheist
Note to all my regular readers: Since An Apostate’s Chapel is a free-speech zone, I don’t censor conversations.
As it appears that cl is a troll, please note that I will not be responding to him any longer. I ask that you refrain from doing so, as well. Please don’t feed the troll!

-The Chaplain
…I can’t reconcile being a "freethinker" with banning speech. [cl's] comments are not offensive in the normal understanding of that term, and he poses absolutely no threat except perhaps to some imagined decorum. Why can’t atheists lighten up, for no-Christ’s sake?

-The Exterminator
Is it going to distract from my meal when crazy uncle cl starts blathering out nonsense, pick his ears with a carrot or start taking his pants off? No. In fact, it might actually heighten the experience in some amusing way. So no, I don't see cl's work as damage.

-PhillyChief
I am beginning to suspect that you are a troll cl. Albeit an evolved troll, but a troll nonetheless. Perhaps we should all stop feeding the troll?

-GaySolomon
Evangelical Realism
[cl is] is either a sophist or an incompetent when it comes to the english language... (sic)

-ThatOtherGuy
Evangelical Realism
I’d say cl is pretty sharp... it may be tempting at times to think that “the other guy” is arguing out of some personal character flaw rather than a sincere desire to acknowledge the truth, I still think it’s better to debate respectfully... It is disrespectful to make unsupported accusations against people, e.g. by suggesting that their views are caused by an intrinsically corrupt and immoral nature.

-Deacon Duncan, 3-9-09
Evangelical Realism
[cl] cannot refute my facts, so he needs must find (sic) some scapegoat in order to claim that he has confronted the enemy and proven them wrong... cl, sadly, has proven himself to be the sort of guest who comes into your living room and sneaks behind your couch to take a crap on the floor, just so he can tell all your neighbors how bad your house smells and what an unsanitary housekeeper you are... an interesting case study in the negative effects a Christian worldview has on a reasonably intellectual mind.

-Deacon Duncan, 6-17-09
Evangelical Realism
I strongly discourage discussion of the character, abilities, motives, or personal ancestry of individual commenters, as tempting as such comments may be at times. I discourage the posting of comments that make frequent use of the pronoun “you,” as in “you always…” or “you never…” or “you are just so…”, when directed at a specific individual.

-Deacon Duncan, 4-9-09
Evangelical Realism
I won’t be publishing your most recent comment because it’s a return to the same sort of schtick you’ve pulled here before: re-writing other people’s arguments to make yourself look misunderstood and/or unfairly accused, taking “polyvalent” positions so that when people address your points you can claim to have said something else, distorting other people’s arguments, trolling for negative reactions, and so on.

-Deacon Duncan, 10-8-09
Evangelical Realism
[E]gomaniacal troll.
You win... You’re a disingenuous sophist through and through, cl. And a friggin’ narcissist to boot! Since I’ve thoroughly and purposefully broken the Deacon’s rules of engagement, I shall consider my right to post henceforth annulled, and move on - dramatic pause, lights out.

-jim
Evangelical Realism
He either thinks in a very weird way or he's quite the con artist.

-mikespeir
I will gladly admit that I have a boner for cl. Maybe some day I’ll even earn a place of honor on cl’s Blog of Infamy.

-Eneasz
Evangelical Realism
Long time reader first time poster... I like reading what you
have to say over at Daylight Atheism so I figured I'd pop in here.

-Pine
He's just a jerk
that likes to argue.

-KShep
Daylight Atheism
You’re not a reasonable thinker in my book. You’re simply an arguer, for better or worse. I’m Michael Palin, you’re John Cleese. You’re just a disputation-ist, bringing everything into question...

-jim
Reason vs. Apologetics
Motherfucker, this is an interesting blog... Quite the group of commenters.

-John Evo
You are very articulate, and I can only assume that it's a result of high intelligence; an intelligence that's interested in, and can understand, healthy debate. However, at every turn, that's not what I or others seem to get.

-ex machina
Daylight Atheism
You are a troll, a liar, and a useless sack of shit. Not only that, but you're still wrong even after moving the goal posts and trying to re-write history. So, you can stop cyber stalking me now and trying to provoke me. I know what you are doing, and you are doing it so that you can whine about how I'm being irrational and mean to you and stroke your pathetic martyr complex. You're a pathetic attention whore and I've already given you too much attention. So, back the fuck off, stop following me around the intarwebs and trying to provoke me, and fuck off.

-OMGF
Daylight Atheism
I would just like to say that, OMGF, having read the debate as a neutral observer, some of the things cl says about your style of argument are true, IMO. It is quite hasty, which means you occasionally haven't got the central point cl is trying to make...

-John D.
Daylight Atheism
...this is a difficult question that deserves more than a kneejerk reaction, not to imply that you're kneejerking. You're the least kneejerking person I've met.

-Quixote
If you’re here playing devil’s advocate, then, hey, you do a great job at it, it’s a service, keep us sharp... You’re a smart guy, but those are exactly the ones who give the worst headaches!

-Lifeguard
An Apostate's Chapel
You are a waste of time, cl. A big fat black hole of bullshit sucking in everyone who comes into contact with you.

-Spanish Inquisitor
As for all that harsh invective that's come your way, umm... I gotta say, I've seen some of the invective, but I haven't seen the behavior on your part that called for it. Maybe I've just not seen enough? I don't know... from what I've read, I can tell that you're a smart person, and whether you deserved any of that treatment or not is quite frankly immaterial to me; I just want to deal with the smart person at the eye of that storm.

-D
She Who Chatters
I now think that you’re an atheist, just having fun at other atheists’ expense. If that’s the case, kudos.

-The Exterminator
You and your commenters are a feast of thinking — great stuff.

-C.L. Dyck

June 12, 2008

May 05, 2008

Random Presidio Photos

The Presidio area is full of interesting photo spots, like these vines.

This tree seemed so rooted to the ground that I had to photograph it.

Another type of tree with some different, splintery qualities.

This rust was on the edge of some metal wheel-type apparatus.

Envisioning some of the conversations and people that might have taken place here.

View from the barracks looking out.

Posted by cl at 22:46 in Photography, San Francisco | Permalink | Comments (0) | TrackBack (0)

Admonition

When faced with unsolved problems, there is no justification for recourse to the supernatural as long as we can offer valid possibilities of rational explanation. God has given us an intellect and expects us to use it.

Overhasty recourse to occult explanations is a flight into the magical and a departure from the will of the Creator, a repudiation of the senses and mental powers He has entrusted to us.

-Kurt E. Koch

Disclaimer

Ambition, avarice, personal animosity, party opposition, and many other motives operate equally upon those who support and those who oppose either side of a question. We, upon many occasions, see wise and good men on the wrong as well as on the right side of questions of the first magnitude to society...

This circumstance, if duly attended to, would furnish a lesson of moderation to those who are ever so persuaded of their being right in any controversy. For in politics, as in religion, it is equally absurd to aim at making proselytes by fire
and sword.

-Alexander Hamilton

Comment Policy

TWIM values free speech. Ads might get cut, that's about it. Comments and criticisms from readers, writers, logicians, freethinkers, believers, skeptics, atheists, agnostics, scientists, theologians, philosophers, cranks, haters and trolls are welcomed. Inflammatory vitriol is subject to harsh rebuttal and/or mockery.

Real Talk

In the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries, science broke loose from theology and the church. In the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, science and medicine separated themselves from philosophy. These are the ruptures of reason to which I refer... We hope to learn that psychology can provide help in repairing these ruptures of reason.

-Viktor von Weizsäcker
In matters that are obscure and far beyond our vision, even in such as we may find treated in the Holy Scripture, different interpretations are sometimes possible without prejudice to the faith we have received. In such a case, we should not rush in headlong and so firmly take our stand on one side that, if further progress in the search of truth justly undermines this position, we too fall with it. That would be to battle not for the teaching of Holy Scripture, but for our own, wishing its teaching to conform to ours, whereas we ought to wish ours to conform to that of Sacred Scripture.

-St. Augustine
None of the names of Einstein's skeptics are remembered. And this is the ignominious fate of most skeptics - because the times and tides of discovery march on and forget they existed.

-Ingo Swann
Science is the tool of the Western mind and with it more doors can be opened than with bare hands. It is part and parcel of our knowledge and obscures our insight only when it holds that the understanding given by it is the only kind there is.

-Carl Gustav Jung
Popery is but the natural development of [the] original transgression. It is just the early idolatries ripened and perfected... Popery is the last, the most matured, the most subtle, the most skilfully contriven, and the most essentially diabolical form of idolatry which the world ever saw, or which, there is reason to believe, it ever will see. It is the ne plus ultra of man’s wickedness, and the chef d’oeuvre of Satan’s cunning and malignity.

-J. A. Wylie
A really stylish fisking is witty, logical, sarcastic and ruthlessly factual; flaming or handwaving is considered poor form.

-Eric S. Raymond
At the heart of science is an essential tension... [A]n openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counter intuitive they may be, and the most ruthless, skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.

-Carl Sagan
Circumstantial evidence is a very tricky thing...
It may seem to point very straight to one thing, but if you shift your own point of view a little, you may find it pointing in an equally uncompromising manner to something entirely different... There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact.

-Sherlock Holmes
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach it in the public school, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools, and the next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and newspapers. Soon you may set Catholic against Protestant and Protestant against Protestant, and try to foist your own religion upon the minds of men...

-Clarence Darrow, 1925
The truth is imperishable, eternal and immortal and needs no human agency to support it...

-Dudley Malone
...this most beautiful system of the sun, planets and comets could only proceed from the counsel and dominion of an intelligent and powerful Being... I find more sure marks of authenticity in the Bible than in any profane history whatsoever.

-Isaac Newton
Creationists and evolutionists are alike in their foolish arrogance. As the Lord asked Job, Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth?

-The Stranger
It is my nature to think where others read; to ask less whether the world agrees with me than whether I agree with the truth.

-Thomas Sydenham
Most families, orders, classes, and phyla appear rather suddenly in the fossil record, often without anatomically intermediate forms smoothly interlinking evolutionarily derived descendant taxa with their presumed ancestors.

-Niles Eldredge
There are many levels of life which we cannot see and know, yet which certainly exist...

-Manly P. Hall
There are two equal and opposite errors into which our race can fall about devils. One is to disbelieve in their existence. The other is to believe and to feel an excessive and unhealthy interest in them. They themselves are equally pleased by both errors and hail a materialist or
a magician with the
same delight.

-CS Lewis
Sins carry their punishment with them by the order of nature and by virtue of the mechanical structure of things itself; and in the same way, noble actions will attract their rewards by ways which are mechanical as far as bodies are concerned...

-Gottfried Leibniz
We may acknowledge a central and surprising fact of life's history, marked decrease in disparity followed by an outstanding increase in diversity within the few surviving designs.

-Stephen Jay Gould
It is a disgraceful and dangerous thing to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn... If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions, how are they going to believe in the matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life and the kingdom of heaven?

-St. Augustine
Liberty cannot be established without morality... It depends upon ourselves whether the principle is to lead to servitude or freedom, to knowledge or barbarism, to prosperity or wretchedness.

-Alexis de Toqueville
If a man's honesty were called into question, it would be ridiculous to refer to the man's own word, whether he be honest or not. The same absurdity there is in attempting to prove, by any kind of reasoning, probable or demonstrative, that our reason is not fallacious, since the very point in question is, whether reasoning may be trusted.

-Thomas Reid
I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong.

-Frederick Douglass
The person who is living at his best is still searching for better ways to live. Such a person has kept the ability to wonder about life. He expects every day to teach him something new and better. He is open-minded and open-hearted, like a little child filled with wonder and delight at every new experience. Jesus found that many religious people, like the Pharisees and the Sadducees, were not teachable. They felt that they already knew all the answers.

-Ross, Hills
One can do all the right things outwardly, have an extensive knowledge of Scripture, and have a vital grasp of church doctrine, but fail badly in relating to and loving people. True Christianity and genuine spirituality cannot be divorced from intimate human relationships.

-Dick Innes
I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me, and causes me to tremble for the safety of our country. Corporations have been enthroned, an era of corruption will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people, until wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the republic is destroyed.

-Abraham Lincoln
The destructive impact of Western Civilization upon so many other societies rests on its ability to demoralize their ideological and spiritual culture as much as its ability to destroy them in a material sense with firearms.

-Carroll Quigley
There was a time when I was running about the world, fancying myself to be well employed, but I was really a most wretched being... I thought that I ought to do anything rather than be a philosopher.

-Plato's Symposium
Well, as of none of the company seem disposed to drink much, I may be forgiven for saying, as a physician, that drinking deep is a bad practice, which I never follow, if I can help, and certainly do not recommend to another, least of all to any one who still feels the effects of yesterday’s carouse.

-Eryximachus
The exuberant overuse of imagination would attempt a solution like putting the socks in the shoes first and then shoving them both on at once or maybe, sewing the socks to the bottom of the pants legs.

-Robert Williams
The thing we pray for may happen, but how can you ever know it was not going to happen anyway? Now even if all the things that people prayed for happened, which they do not, this would not prove what Christians mean by the efficacy of prayer. For prayer is request. The essence of request, as distinct from compulsion, is that it may or may not be granted. And if an infinitely wise Being listens to the requests of finite and foolish creatures, of course He will sometimes grant and sometimes refuse them. Invariable "success" in prayer would not prove the Christian doctrine at all. It would prove something much more like magic...

-C.S. Lewis
...it is impossible, I say, for the human mind not to believe that there is, in all this, design, cause and effect, up to an ultimate cause, a fabricator of all things from matter and motion, their preserver and regulator while permitted to exist in their present forms, and their regenerator into new and other forms.

-Thomas Jefferson
If you are a creationist looking for credibility with non-creationists, it's a losing proposition. Just being a creationist ruins whatever credibility you might have had in the eyes of the world. The best you can hope for is a kind of grudging acknowledgment that you're not a complete idiot.

-Todd Wood
What we call science had its primary origin in the contemplation of the cosmos. It is, therefore, in the last analysis only a derivative of the empirical world, an abstraction and logical classification of that which, in creation and historical development, is recognized as conforming to laws.

-Kurt E. Koch

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the warfare is mental

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June 12, 2008

Ken Goto